International Rules?

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Max V.
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Re: International Rules?

Beitrag von Max V. » Mo 24. Sep 2018, 16:54

The rulebook has two problems to solve. For one it must capture how the German community wants to play Jugger. On the other hand it shall explain Jugger to newbies. The rulebook we have is the middleground. If you are building according to the rulebook the chance that your Pompfe is dangerous is slim as long you put a little bit of thinking to it. To use the materials which are on vogue also helps.
However in Russia you can actually do what you like. If the people you play with are okay with the materials you use you guys should just do fine. No need for German Pompfen censorship.
SkiF hat geschrieben:
Mo 24. Sep 2018, 16:05
You mostly operate your experience, not only your rulebook, when you check Pompfen, don't you?
Yes and no since all of the criteria for the checks derived from the rules. In a shocking twist it is now revealed to you that most of the rules start as single experience till eventually they are generally excepted and become a rule. So far Jugger has ever been in a state of flux.
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Ricky
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Re: International Rules?

Beitrag von Ricky » Mo 24. Sep 2018, 18:53

In addition: New Teams mostly build nice pompfen anyways, even without experienced players helping them.
But nonetheless we are a community. If unsure, just ask for tips in the region you want to play. People will definitely help you very well.
Pink ist das neue Bunt!

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SkiF
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Re: International Rules?

Beitrag von SkiF » Di 25. Sep 2018, 08:01

Ok, thanks guys. I've got your point of view. And will try to explain it to our local community. There are a lot of food for thought.
My travel blog: skif.lince.ru

>>> Jugger in Russia <<<

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Wendy
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Re: International Rules?

Beitrag von Wendy » Fr 9. Nov 2018, 03:06

It is interesting to see the Australian Spar building being referenced when our gear checks in Australia suffer from major drawbacks because of it.

We cannot gear check equipment properly according to our rules without pulling it apart (because of all the rules of how far from the core padding needs to be). So there is no real way to check that people are following some of the rules including "minimum padding" specifications. What is written in our Spar Specifications contains a lot of guidance towards how we encourage gear to be made in Australia and we check what we can as gear checkers. You will be interested to know that this has been flagged as something to be reviewed and updated. Work has been started to take the rules from the Spar Specifications document and incorporate it into the Australian Jugger Rulebook and leave behind a spar builders guide. The Australian Jugger League community will then drive what happens next.

We also suffer similar problems as elsewhere when it comes to how much the foam must be able to compress. Our wording of how to check the padding was not being utilised and we found people resorting to the European check of digging thumbs in deep to try and feel the core. Similarly, padding checks of pommels has come under fire at tournaments as different gear checkers have different ideas of pass/fail.

In my travels I see bad habits creeping in because of variations in rules. I saw at the Irish tournament players added a tiny piece of padding and tape to create a pommel or a staff's "sleeve" that passed Irish specs and ripping it off immediately after. Or the piece of coloured tape added to pompfen for a German pommel check.

In my opinion pushing a single thumb (or two) into padding with a lot of force does not represent gameplay or how the padding compresses under game usage. I believe compression checks should refer to how well the padding distributes force and compresses under normal usage (and known cases). Adding a minimum amount of compression (a few centimetres?) required by striking tips might also help with that critical area. I would be interested to see what data could be compiled about setting weight restrictions on pompfen. We can easily weigh equipment at a gear check, but not easily pull equipment apart to check you added 20mm of padding to the core and didn't then apply so much tape that it is now only 10mm off the core.

If someone started an international rules committee, committed to creating specifications accepted worldwide, I would be there with bells on! :hula:
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SkiF
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Re: International Rules?

Beitrag von SkiF » Di 13. Nov 2018, 18:55

Wendy hat geschrieben:
Fr 9. Nov 2018, 03:06
We cannot gear check equipment properly according to our rules without pulling it apart (because of all the rules of how far from the core padding needs to be).
Why wouldn't you try to use thin measuring needle? It doesn't damage your spar and allow to know the width of padding.
But, in total, I got your point. And agree that all of existing rules is not so perfect in Pompfen building questions. There a many omissions.
My travel blog: skif.lince.ru

>>> Jugger in Russia <<<

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Wendy
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Re: International Rules?

Beitrag von Wendy » Do 15. Nov 2018, 04:46

SkiF hat geschrieben:
Di 13. Nov 2018, 18:55
Why wouldn't you try to use thin measuring needle? It doesn't damage your spar and allow to know the width of padding.
But, in total, I got your point. And agree that all of existing rules is not so perfect in Pompfen building questions. There a many omissions.
The needle is a good idea - but maybe not the safest if you have to check many pieces of gear! It would probably bend or be covered in the sticky stuff from tape after a few pompfen!

The needle would not pierce what is commonly being used to pad pommels. Even though they usually have a little bit of compression, they are much more sturdy and are built to be far more rigid. Which means a lot more tape, or more rigid foam, or other material (sometimes rubber).

Rules should set down the absolute line of what must be adhered to. A guide to building would help to ensure pompfen builds are being done to the best possible standard by more people and that new developments, and materials are captured.
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... ... Shiny!
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